Think meditation is hard? Do me a favor, take a slow deep breath in and now breathe out. Congratulations, you just meditated. Hi, I’m Krystal Jakosky, and this is Breathe In, Breathe Out: a Weekly Mindfulness and Meditation podcast for anyone ready to own their own shit and find a little peace while doing it.
Krystal Jakowsky: Hello everyone. And welcome back to Breathe In, Breathe Out. I am Krystal Jakowsky and as always, I'm so thrilled and excited that you are here today. I'm just on cloud nine. I am with our guest and I'm excited to just introduce you to her and have this conversation so that we can all just open up a little bit and feel free and easy. Today I get to talk with Liz Dube, a certified sex therapist, coach, and licensed marriage and family therapist who loves working with people who really want to better understand themselves sexually and feel sexually empowered. She's helped thousands of men, women, and couples feeling stuck sexually and is working her ass off to save the world one bedroom at a time. I am telling you if you have not heard of her or gone to her, you or her TikTok channel, you have to go check it out. She is absolutely hilarious, very open, and just fun. I highly encourage you to go to @talksexwithliz. Check her out on TikTok and oh my God. Welcome.
Liz Dube: Thanks, Krystal. Do you flatter all your guests so much? I feel so special after that introduction.
Krystal Jakosky: That's just, oh honey, we're talking sex. The thing is with my audience, and with your listeners, we have talked a lot about self-care. We have talked about opening up. We have talked about self-ownership and Liz is in that realm. I'm so excited that you're here because I think that this is one of those areas that we are still not talking about enough. We personally don't know where we're at. So to have you here and to be able to just open that up and break it out a little bit is just thrilling. So it's all, you baby. I'm excited.
Liz Dube: I love talking about self-care because you know what, if you are not having a sex drive, if you're struggling sexually, oftentimes it can be really related to lack of self-care. I think that this is such a perfect meshing of top bits because what you do outside the bedroom is what you do inside the bedroom. As they say, wherever you go, there you are. And we can't really separate the two, if you're not doing self-care, that's going to block things.
Krystal Jakosky: There's this quote online that I'm going to paraphrase. So many people have paraphrased it. I apologize to whoever said it first, because I'm not sure who you are, but paraphrasing over paraphrasing is basically that the relationship that you have with others is simply a mirror of the relationship that you have with yourself. This is so true in every avenue of your life and yet in the bedroom or outside the bedroom, wherever it is that you get a little sexy and fun, that is absolutely a reflection of your own relationship with yourself and where you're at, how you feel. How do we break that down? How do we open that up? So, Liz is here to help us. Liz is here to talk about that and break it open. So what brought you to become a sex therapist?
Liz Dube: Well, it's my second career, but I, when I look back on who I am as a person, and what brought me to this work because it's pretty hard to separate the therapist from the person as is, it was back when I was 16 working at Supreme burger and it was clean up at nine o'clock. We'd close the shop and turned on Dr. Ruth on the radio. I would listen and thought, this is the Rast woman. I wanna be her when I grow up. That was just a little twinkle in my eye. And it was delayed another 20 years, but I did grow up. My mom was really progressive. She was open about the topic of sex. It wasn't this taboo thing. She was open with her sexuality and sensuality.
I saw her giving herself permission and showing up in ways that were sex-positive and being open with my questions. So I think growing up in that environment gave me the opportunity to get accurate information about sex. Then I started to notice, wait a second, other people don't have this. I had so many girlfriends that were shut off that didn't know anything. Then I thought, when I get older after college, they'll figure it out. They'll take college classes and they'll figure it out. I had friends who were doctors and lawyers, and they were still shut off, clueless. At a very young age, I became the unlicensed, unofficial sex therapist in their lives. And so with that, I guess it got reinforced this, the idea of exploring sex and sexuality. I entered the field of psychology. I worked in psychology and did coaching and consulting related to that. But it took me a little while. I guess I was a late bloomer. This was my second career and I felt like I have to do what I'm supposed to do in life and, figure out how to make money doing it. And it took me a little while, but I figured it out.
Krystal Jakosky: So you had a progressive mom, you had someone who really modeled healthy sexual behavior. When you said, Hey, mom, I'm gonna be a sex therapist. Did she give you a high five? What, was her reaction?
Liz Dube: This was also the point where my mom passed away and that's when I decided to become a sex therapist. She died really young. She died at 52. And that was one of the pivotal things. I thought, shit, if I've got hurt, if I die early too, then I, I need to figure this out. And so those moments in life give you that carpe diem, like oh man, life is short. And so when I did decide to do it, it was funny. My siblings said, oh my God, mom's going to be would've been so proud of you. I think she would've loved it. She was pretty crass. I get a lot of that from her. I think that she is probably smiling up there.
Krystal Jakosky: Your loss saddens me. It breaks my heart. I'm so glad that you have your siblings and that everyone is in the same boat. She's definitely looking down just rude, rude. I'm in a different boat. I am one of those people that was closed off because I had a highly religious upbringing. The traditional dare I say, inadequate, absolutely inadequate sex education that you get in the school system and whatnot with a very awkward conversation with the parent afterward. It made me wonder I'm not sure I really wanna do that. So never mind, I'll just backpedal a little bit. And then you learn more from your friends or magazines or movies and whatnot than you actually get from anybody else. It's really not healthy because it's not reality. It's not the truth. So learning, wait a minute. So I should feel, figure out what I like and it's okay to ask those questions and it's okay to try to figure that out. Like none of that was even in any kind of realm until I was much older. I daresay within the last five, 10 years where I finally, and I've had two kids, it's been recently that I'm like, oh, wait a minute. Let's just … and the middle schooler mind comes out. It feels like second puberty.
Liz Dube: Yes. And then we're expected to learn about sex from Hollywood and porn and that's all mythical, it really is just so contrived and it creates so many unrealistic, romantic ideals, unrealistic performances. And I tell people, get Hollywood out of your bedroom because that is really fucking a lot of people up that is not in a good way.
Krystal Jakosky: Not at all in a good way. It's tragic. It's absolutely tragic. I had somebody say to me, I really just don't know who I am in the bedroom because I know what I'm supposed to be. What do you mean by you're supposed to be? And they said society says this. And I said, what society? Let me quote this movie or let me quote this or let me. I said no, no, no, no, all of that is just bullshit. Let's forget that. Start with the basics of inside and who you are.
Liz Dube: Yeah. And I think women, in particular, are taught to follow and that shows up in the bedroom that we follow our partners. And your story is really the majority from my experience. It makes sense to me that a lot of people aren't figuring things out until later in life, because, they're busy doing other things. Like careers, marriage, children, and you just kind of follow where they lead you, or you just kind of go with the flow and, and then you get to a place where maybe you have this space to get curious.
Krystal Jakosky: How do you start those conversations when you are finally in this space where you think think you want to open up, I think I wanna explore. I think I want to shed all the prep that I've taken in and start finding my own thing. How do you start those conversations with partners?
Liz Dube: I always think about these two words, curiosity and compassion. I use those two frames as a frame of reference that you start asking questions. What do you like, what are your turn-ons? What are your turn-offs? Be really compassionate with the information that they share with you. Because so much of what we hold inside and are uncomfortable sharing is rooted in a fear of rejection, fear of judgment. If our partners feel like a judge, they're going to shut down and they're not going to truly share and be transparent about what they desire. They're not going to be open to getting curious with you. They're not going to be open to being playful or experimental. We want them to show up in that energy. We can create that space by showing up with compassion and curiosity.
And then if you're in a healthy relationship where there is where then that's gonna be reciprocated. And so your partner then is going to start asking you questions about what you like? Well tell them I want to know because anyone that cares about you, they want to know, but sometimes we don't really know. I think this is one of the struggles to say I think I like this, but I don't really know. And, so I encourage you to show up from a blank slate and focus on the five senses. How would you like to feel touch? How would you like to give touch? How would you like to receive it? Focus on things like smells, tastes, and visuals. You tap into all those five senses and start to think about what are the that have turned me on.
This is where Hollywood could be helpful if you could use what you've seen. What has turned you on, what has turned you off? What do you like to hear? Do you want to hear your partner say, yeah, fuck me? I love your tit your ass. Or do you want them to say, you have such a beautiful body. I love you. This feels so good. What sort of energy are you? What are you longing for? And the more specific that you can be with your partner, then the conversation expands if they can be non-judgmental and curious as well.
Krystal Jakosky: What if you are the one that says, no, I don't like that. Even though you do. And yet here you are saying, oh, what I really like is really wrong because of the closed-off-ness that you've been raised with.
Liz Dube: You know, this is something I work a lot on with clients. So much of sex therapy is giving people permission to want what they want and to recognize that what you resist persists, and the more that you try to push down the things that you find erotic, the more they're going to keep bubbling. It's like whack-a-mole, it's gonna keep showing up, you know?
I would encourage, you to talk about this even though it is hard. The sex therapist said it was okay. You've probably heard that your kinks or your fantasies are okay at one point or another, but there's that part of you that says I don't care that someone else said it's okay because this still feels wrong. So I really encourage people to get curious about themselves. What is it about that that feels like it's not okay? Where did you learn that and do your values line with what you learned? A lot of the things that we grew up with and that we learned from our parents, society, and religion, aren't necessarily our values. So why are you using someone else's values to measure what's right or wrong for you? That would be a good place to start. I certainly would encourage people to read books so that they can start to educate themselves with accurate information rather than relying on Cosmo's top 10 ways to get off or, you know, I'm aging myself. Now. I remember my mom said, you're not reading that shit. No Cosmo for you.
Krystal Jakosky: There's no shit in it. It's all about sex. It's good.
Liz Dube: Oh my God. I'm never gonna get an article in Cosmo now I'm screwed.
Krystal Jakosky: Sorry.
Liz Dube: No, I love your response because that's very much something that we talk about is the fact that whose voice are you really listening to? When you hear something that says you suck or that's wrong, or you shouldn't be doing this, or you should be doing that, whose voice is it really that's talking? Is it your personal inner voice? Is it your truth? Or is it that voice and truth that is society or the stuff that you grew up with or the other beliefs that came from other trusted sources and whatnot? Whose voice is telling you that that is yuck, whose voice is telling you that you are wrong to enjoy something that feels so good? Once you understand whose voice that is, then it's a little bit easier to say, you know, I don't want to listen to that anymore because it’s my body, my being is telling me this is right.
Krystal Jakosky: Yeah. And if it feels right then it's self-care like you are giving your spotty, your soul, your spirit, something that you desperately need. It is a form of self-care let's do more of it, please.
Liz Dube: Yeah. I think that our bodies know what we need, what we want, and what we desire and our bodies will often speak for us when we don't speak for our bodies. I mean, it's just as simple as that, give yourself permission just to want what you want, educate yourself in what is sexy and what turns us on can oftentimes be socially constructed. Like why isn't a big belly on a woman sexy, why aren't saggy tits sexy? I mean don't let those socially constructed ideas of what is the sexy influence you to the extent that you don't get to lean into the things that turn you on or that you want, because it's like, there's this weird narrow box of what's considered sexy, okay. Sex to have. It's so funky. And I think it really is. I think it really is socially constructed Hollywood stuff, Hollywood bullshit.
Krystal Jakosky: Yeah. Stick in this box. Don't come outside of it. Don't test the norms, which are, that there is no norm. Realistically, we are all so hugely different that the entire realm of sex is so huge and vast and opportunistic. You can find something that works for you. It'll just be amazing when you allow yourself to.
Liz Dube: If you lean into it, if you've got some kinks that feel like this is against the grain, honey, Google that shit. You will find somebody that likes the same stuff. You can find some groups to join. And there's a whole world out there for you. You don't have to push yourself down,
Krystal Jakosky: Try it out. If there's something that you are excited about. And you're like, oh my gosh, that really turns me on. You may try it out. You may find that you absolutely love it and you want to do more of it. And yet you also may find that that was a great one-time chance or a one-time opportunity or this or that. But it's not an every-to-time kind of thing. For me, it's like frosting on the cake. It's good to have a little, but not too much. It's all about exploring. It's all about just saying, Hey, where am I at? And what do I want? Which just makes you even more attractive because you can guide people through that, right?
Liz Dube: Yeah. Me more. Oh yeah. Me or the person.
Krystal Jakosky: Whatever partner it is that you chose on a fun thing you're gonna go for, oh my gosh. I wanna talk to you about a conversation that we had, and you mentioned women and how women often end up closing down in public and they have to put on all this protective gear. Can you REPA on that out for our listeners? Because I just like when you mentioned this concept, I just was sitting with it saying that is so absolutely true on so many different levels. It's not just women that go through this, but it's everyone who goes through this in some way, shape, or form. With that opening, can you dive into it?
Liz Dube: I love talking about this. It's kind of related to this idea that clients will come to me and their sexuality has been shut down and then they get married. Maybe they were saving themselves for marriage, or maybe they've become a mom. There's a transition in their life where they go. I'm trying to turn it back on. And I don't know how to turn it back on. They don't realize that all day long or all their lives they've been shutting down their sexuality because of a fear of being ashamed, being shamed, being told what you have to be, you can be a little bit sexy, but it doesn't get slutty. So there's this as the judgment of other people, other women that might judge us for showing up in a way that is like who do you think you are?
Or like the judgment about being slutty. Then there's the piece of our safety that we walk around all day long, shutting down our sexuality because we have to keep ourselves safe. And some of that is a real danger from being assaulted. And some of that's just the emotional danger from being verbally assaulted from people that are, that think that because we're dressing in a certain way that that is sexy and makes us feel good is us saying, I'm asking for it, like this idea of that a woman dressing a certain way would be calling someone to come and rape her saying you want it. There are so many messages about women that we are constantly being shut down. And then we go into the safety of our own home, our own homes.
And now it's okay, let's flip the switch. That's hard to do. Or being a mom all day where you can't be on the playground dressed sexy. You've gotta dress like the other moms because you don't want the other moms to judge you that you're trying to be sexy. You're a mom, don't try to be sexy. You're a mom. Now that's that period of time is done. You get to be sexy during these small little windows in your lifespan, and now you don't get to get to be sexy anymore. But then you go to your relationship you're trying to figure out how do I ignite my desire? You don't even realize you've been shutting it down for years on a daily basis. So many women I'm working with, I’m working on the basics of figuring out where their desire got lost along the way.
When did they start shutting it down and how to give themselves permission to start igniting it again? Because it is hard if you are going out in the corporate world thinking, you're in a job and you feel like you can't dress too sexy because you don't either want to be sexually or harassed. I also want to be taken seriously. There's so much that goes into use on a daily basis about squashing it. I think that men don't as often have to experience that. That is often one of the big reasons why there's this discrepancy and desire between men and women and I think it's important for women to hear that, to normalize that so that we don't have to feel like we're broken. We're not broken. We've just been protecting ourselves. And it's hard to flip that switch when you get into the safety of your home and go, okay, I've been squashing it all day now, how do I ignite things?
Krystal Jakosky: Yeah. It's the out little kid trying to reach for the candy jar and their hand keeps getting smacked away. Eventually, they just learn, okay, Frank, I don't want the cookie jar. And here we are, we've been thinking, well, maybe I want the cookie jar. Nevermind. I can't, I've gotta breastfeed or I've gotta go cook dinner. I've gotta do some laundry. I've gotta go to the corporate world. I've gotta do this. Do I have the opportunity to go to that cookie jar? When do I have the option to do that? And how do you flip that switch from, okay, now I've been everything everyone else needs me to be, I get to do this for 10 minutes? Then I've got to go back. It's not easy to do that.
And it's really unfair. My husband and I went on a vacation and he encouraged me to dress up for this one outing. I just looked at him and said, I got dressed. He said, are you sure? I like to dress nice. I like to feel good because it just makes me feel even better. I really want to put myself out there. But I dressed down that day and I was wearing a t-shirt and some shorts and it was cute, but it wasn't what I normally would wear. He said, why are you wearing that instead of this? And I said because you are not going to be with me for a little while in this place. And if I dressed in that outfit, more people would be looking at me and I would personally feel uncomfortable and unsafe because what are people thinking about me in this space?
Because I would be dressed a little bit more than the locals or the other people that are around here and I'm not ready to be in that space. But that also meant that you're saying that we would come back at the end of the day and he wanted me to feel sexy and fabulous all day so that we could come home. I can't do that for my own safety. I've got to feel okay. And finding that balance between what works for me and how do I take care of myself and then how do I express myself later? It doesn't mean that it's not possible, guys. It does not mean that you cannot do it. You cannot figure out ways to flip that switch. It means that you get to be aware of it and you get to say, Hey, you know what?
I want to make this happen. And I know that I have to go out into the world and I have to put my armor on for the day. I am setting an intention for the evening to be able to take all that armor off and be me in all of my glory. And so you set little steps or little things throughout the day, or for when you get home, maybe you're gonna have dinner delivered or maybe someone gets home before the other and they start a bath or what little steps can you put into action, into play so that you more easily slip into or out of the armor. It's totally possible. You can absolutely do it. Liz, you have a four-week online coaching program.
Liz Dube: Yes, that is it. So I just want to say that was such a great exact example of what women experience every day and the fact that I love how you explain that because I think people really need to relate that we are all struggling with these married, single, divorced moms, no moms. And I just, I love that. That was such a great example to be able to help people really grab. And those examples are what help people in my program. It's a four-week online coaching program. I designed this because I get so many clients, and some clients, a lot of clients can't afford therapy. This is a great program for people who maybe don't want therapy, they can't afford therapy.
This is a program that is really designed for women who are struggling with desire, or who just want to be sexually empowered. They're like, I don't really know where to begin. Through the four-week online coaching program with me, I actually give them the tools to be able to start identifying what are they doing. That's shutting it down tools to be able to prioritize sex and start to ignite things, tools, to be able to communicate to their partners about what they've figured out through that program. You will get weekly time with me and, with specific guidance, to be able to walk you through this program on a weekly basis. Every week there's also a Q and A where you can ask me any question and make it specific to you because it's not just this cookie-cutter idea of what ignites desire because everybody's going to be different. So you need to figure out what ignites your desire for you. That's where the tools that I give you, help you to identify that. And then I'm there to be able to answer questions, to walk through it. This is one more way for me to save the world one bedroom at a time. Because I was one-on-one coaching and one-on-one therapy is not getting me there fast enough.
Krystal Jakosky: Yeah. So two questions for you in your course can be, does everybody know that it's you like me in your course?
Liz Dube: It's completely anonymous. People don't want to talk about that. So it is in a zoom format, but you only get to see me. Then all of my participants, I encourage to create their naughty diva names. Those are the names that they'll be using in their communication with me in the communication with the group. But no one will be on video except for me. Nobody will be using their real names. I'll make sure they have their naughty like Fran loves to fuck or is hoping to fuck. I don't know, whatever names that you end up creating to get you in that mindset.
Krystal Jakosky: I have one other question. You've said that it's for women who are struggling, and I know that there are men who also struggle. Have you had men that have taken this course and been able to just learn a little bit more about themselves and free up or do you try to stick more with the feminine side?
Liz Dube: I really stick with the feminine side. The course is designed for women. And there are a number of reasons for that. Throughout the years, I've found that a lot of the same tools work for my guys who are struggling with desire, but it's a really different framework that affects men. Even though the same mindset goes into it, when I treat clients as this men or women, I found that in order for me to really have a program that fits, it really is for women. So that'll be like the 2.0 for the guys. Someday when I get enough of them that want to participate
Krystal Jakosky: Yeah, that is fantastic. I stole a quote from your website and I just want to read it right now. It says we find that most problems with sex are driven by things that are not directly related to the actual act of sex. It's all of the other stuff, like insecurities about our bodies, beliefs we have about what good sex looks like, how men and women are supposed to form sexually overall dissatisfaction in our relationships related to unresolved conflict, resentment towards our partner, communication difficulties, respect, loyalty trust, et cetera. You guys, I cannot tell you enough how important it is to get in touch with you, get in touch with who you are, what you like, what you are excited about, what excites you you'll feel more alive, you'll feel more expressed. You will feel more open and ready to just experience life in every way, shape, and form. That is possible. Liz, is there anything else that you want to add to our little chit-chat before we head out?
Liz Dube: Yeah. Well, I do want people to go to my TikTok because I have so much fun with that.
I just get excited. I get so excited when people see it because it brings me back to my twenties and my friends didn't know what a conquering was and that's a really important thing.
Krystal Jakosky: Right. It's very beneficial.
Liz Dube: I would love people to go to my website, www.talksexwithliz.com, and see what I have to offer. I've written blogs. I'm on podcasts all the time. And I just want to share it because people need accurate information. It's hard for women to be able to figure out how to balance these lives we live in. We're so busy, we're sacrificing all the time for so many people and sex is supposed to be a selfish act. It's about pleasure and connection. And if we're constantly doing things for other people, then sex begins. It's one more thing on our to-do list. Like that's, you know, and, and so you're not gonna really find yourself in that experience if you aren't giving yourself and to be able to lead into what you want and to also start giving yourself permission to say no, and to do the self-care that you're always touting. It's important. I think women just don't even have a clue sometimes. They're wondering why they've lost their desire, you've lost your desire. Of course, you're struggling sexually. And I just really I'm wanting to help. This is a topic that I love.
Krystal Jakosky You said a couple of things I just have to bring out again. So number one, permission, you guys, you telling you guys permission to be you always, that means permission, in every way, shape and form. Not only are we giving it to you, but you also need to give it to yourself. We are telling you that it is okay to have permission and give yourself permission to enjoy that. And the other thing I want to just bring out is consent. That's one of the conversations you need to have with your partners just say yes. What does yes mean and that's okay. You need to stick to that and be solid on that. So permission to be you and consent, have those conversations. Liz, I have a few questions for you. Green or orange,
Liz Dube: Orange
Krystal Jakosky: City or country?
Liz Dube: Country.
Krystal Jakosky: Large groups or personal time,
Liz Dube: Large groups,
Krystal Jakosky: Pine trees or salty ocean air
Liz Dube: Salty ocean air.
Krystal Jakoky: Which season and why
Liz Dube: Fall? Because it reminds me of when it was time to go back to school and I'm an extrovert. So during the summer, I got lonely. I wanted to see everybody and go to school. It was a safe refuge for me growing up.
Krystal Jakosky: Oh wow. And my last one is, as far as self-care goes, what is the most unique form of self-care you like indulging in?
Liz Dube: I was going to say masturbation, but that wasn't unique. That's just on the tip of my tongue. Because I don't think I said masturbation in this whole podcast. And so I think I couldn't leave without saying that. So the most unique, oh, I don't know if this is unique, but when my partner and I, the house that we live in, we gutted it and we made a bedroom into a bathroom. So I have a huge bathroom and I like to have just nice, slow mornings, getting myself ready, taking a shower, and my beautiful shower. Being able to be in an environment that I feel is beautiful. And I am, and I get to take my time to listen to music, listen to podcasts and slowly get ready and work out the kinks in my curly hair. And so those mornings are really important to me and having a beautiful space to have that time alone with myself.
Krystal Jakosky: That is so beautiful. I'm so perfect. Hey guys, did you hear that? She likes to have slow mornings to get into your day. Nice and easy and create this beautiful space that you can do that is because that's just a reflection of you and where you're at. So you can find
[email protected] on the TikTok sock talk sex with Liz. She's got a YouTube channel talking sex with Liz. I'm telling you she's just fabulous and fun. I spent the morning just giggling and listening to Liz anyway, just because it puts me in the mood to chat with you. So check out her online course and find her in any which way that you want to. And realistically, as I all always say, if you're not quite ready here if Liz doesn't really work for you, and yet you're interested in it, find somebody who does find somebody who helps to open you up and helps you to explore everything there is to explore about your personal intimacy, your personal connection with yourself physically. How do you feel and how do you connect with the people around you, Liz? Thank you so much for being here.
Liz Dube: Thanks, Krystal. I love your energy. It was a blessing to be here. I really enjoyed talking with you and seeing your face and your smile. Thanks for having me.
Krystal Jakosky. Thank you. You are an absolutely beautiful human being inside and out, and I'm just grateful for you. Hey guys, until next time, we'll see you here on Breathe In, Breathe Out.
I hope this moment of self-care and healing brought you some hope and peace. I’m @krystaljakosky on Instagram, Facebook, and YouTube and I hope you check us out and follow along for more content coming soon. I look forward to being with you again here on Breathe In, Breathe Out. Until next time, take care.
